INTRO
Welcome to another inspiring episode of Believe in Future. Today we are honoured to have Judith Raven with us. Judith is a former career diplomat with the US government. Boasting an impressive 20 years of experience in international relations.
Foreign policy is strategic communication and complex project management. Her career and personal initiative have taken her across Asia, Africa, Latin America and now to the Dominican Republic, where she is currently a second year fellow with the Dream Project, an award winning NGO and educational center. In addition to her diplomatic career, Judith has a rich background as an editor, translator, journalist, making significant contributions in various global settings. She holds a master’s degree in Romance Language and Literature with Harvard University, and a Bachelor of Arts in Spanish from Brandeis University. Her passion for global mobility and continuous learning in challenging environments has driven her to build bridges of positive transformation throughout her career. Judith is a pleasure to welcome to our show. Amazing mentor. Welcome. Thank you.
What were some early experiences or influences that sparked your interest in global affairs and languages? moment or experience from your student’s day that signifies impact, your personal or academic trajectory?
As a child, I was a collector of stamps and coins and postcards only if they were written from a foreign country. Usually I could not identify, and I think those small windows into the world.
Whether a country chose to highlight flora, fauna, historical personages, architecture. I really think that was the beginning. Very unconscious of the wish to know more about the world. And up until a couple of years ago, my last move, I did have some very old postcards of foreign places from people I didn’t know. People would just pass them on to my family so they would pass on to me.
were there any specific mentor or figures during your transformative year who inspired you to pursue a career in international relations?
I wish I had mentors, but that was not really my privilege. So life is not linear, and the way I got to where I was a very circuitous course. Eventually, in a leadership position, I did have a couple of wonderful mentors. Mentors are also those people one meets along the way, and a mentorship relationship is two way. I at first observed what people around me were doing. I remember someone who, when I was studying in Spain, someone who was maybe a few years older than me, and I visited her in Madrid. She was a friend of a family. I noticed she worked on the local economy. And so again, like a light bulb went off in my head that this is possible. And so it was always observing. There was another, a two sisters who were studying in southern France, and they were really studying with, with live models, with being surrounded by artists. And so I realized the world was, as you make it. Those were those experiences that I didn’t have mentors. But by just looking around and seeing what people were doing, I could draw from their experiences the wealth of possibilities that were out there for me as a leader. I did seek a more official mentorship relationship because oftentimes one finds the circumstance where you you need to respect the fact that you are the head person for hundreds of people, and therefore anyone that you confide in could be taken as a biased relationship. So I looked elsewhere and that was very helpful. Someone who was completely outside of the operating environment that I was in.
how did your education in France, Spain and United States. Shape your worldview and career aspirations again.
There too, there were, you know, some dozen different universities that I attended in France. I had graduated high school early. I graduated in December. The rest of my class graduated in June. That was a fascinating experience, because I learned what it means to be truly independent and to bear the consequences of one’s own decisions. In Spain, I was attending classes at a 13th century university. So the beauty of architecture, the presence of history, always the presence of living history in the United States, depending on where I was, I also learned a great deal. At one point I was actually studying in New York, in Vermont, in Massachusetts, and so on. So every place I took something in, every place I left a bit of me. And I think the key there is to be adaptable and flexible, and when a particular institution is not giving you as much as you intellectually wish, or on the experiential level, seek and find more.
So any childhood dream or ambition that you thought, okay, I would be this when I grow up.
| The only thing I knew was I had a passion for languages and I always pursued that. At the time, online radio didn’t exist, so shortwave radio was something I listened to all the time. And still today, I listen to foreign language news broadcast. But of course I can do that online. At that point it was, you know, 2 or 3 in the morning when there was no static in the atmosphere and logging in, where I had tuned into and what the station was called and what languages they were broadcasting to in. And that was, again, just like, what’s the musicality of the language? Can I understand it? Do I not know what language it’s in? But I know what language group it’s it belongs to. And I think on a passive level that really developed my ear for languages because I was exposed to so much. The other really seminal experience when I was young teenager was I was able to spend the summer months in Mexico as a gesture of appreciation. An exchange student from Mexico in my high school, who didn’t get along with her host family and my family, was able to take her in. She actually shared a room with me, and her family was so grateful that they invited me and I had the chance to be. It was an informal relationship between the two families, an immersion experience, and I knew from there that I didn’t know how. But this is something I needed more of because it was really challenging and I could use all of my Spanish skills and I could learn every day, you know, the whole idea of continuous learning. |
how was your experience in college? Any college memory that you can share with us?
I was great literature student when I was at Harvard. I read at least eight hours a day, so I think literature became a part of my life for that. I remember one of the they almost wouldn’t let me graduate because I had read Don Quixote de la mancha, which is a classic Spanish novel, and I didn’t buy the copy. I had borrowed it from the library multiple times, so I could read it a couple of times, and I didn’t want to give it back to the library. But, you know, in the United States, they track these things. And so they told me I wouldn’t be able to graduate unless I gave my copy, which of course was not my copy. Back to the library. So, yeah, literature became a part of my everyday life.
what was your first job in the field of international relations or related area, and how did it shape your career?
Maybe technically, in a certain way. I was director of the Spanish department in a foreign language bookstore. So international relations only in the sense of I was always communicating to publishers in Mexico, in Spain, in Colombia, in Central America. Then I had a really unique opportunity when I was living in Tokyo, to be the translator for the Embassy of Peru. So this was not my country. I was what’s called a third country national, working with host nationals and with foreign diplomats, looking at the type of communications that governments have bilaterally or multilaterally. I translated tenders and thank you notes and proposals and whatever came my way. So that was, I would say, really, that was technically my first experience in a diplomatic mission. But of course it was not for my country.
can you describe your experience working as a journalist and proofreader?
My experience as a journalist in West Africa was a reality check on what freedom of expression means in different parts of the world. When I worked there and investigative journalist was killed, Norbert Zongo, he was assassinated. He was doing a very sensitive investigative piece on the brother of the president at the time and his alleged involvement in something. And I remember everyone in the office went out and protested because I worked for an opposition newspaper, and one never really knew if we would be closed or not, and in fact, they ultimately were closed by the government. Some years ago. But that was an amazing experience. I worked with very brave journalists, very creative journalists. It was a little bit of a multicultural team. There was someone from France. There was me and then the rest were Burkinabé. So that was an amazing experience in Argentina. I was a journalist and I had about six interviews a week, and I learned how to ask good questions despite my list of questions. Listen to the answers because sometimes the answers led to other insights. Interestingly, as a woman, sometimes I caught my interviewee off guard and their defenses were down and I could get more information just because, you know, they they just I don’t know, maybe it’s that emotional intelligence, but they, you know, the conversation was really flowing. And then as a proofreader, I’m my brain is very detail oriented an advantage and a disadvantage. But that was a natural thing which I then developed, of course, through working in publishing for many years and through professional development to this day. That’s a really important skill into any of the communicators out there, or young people who wish to follow any sort of path that involves writing. Proofreading is is a really important skill so that before you hit send, before you say this is the final or final draft, you check again. You have four other eyes on the document. You make sure that the that what you think is the best is truly the best that you can produce.
what motivated you to transition from journalism to a career in diplomacy?
It was what we call in American English, a total fluke. No one could plan that. I was living in Tokyo. I had 13 jobs. So one one of my evening jobs was as a news writer, and I was preparing for the evening news, and there was an advertisement in the local paper that the Foreign Service exam was to be given. And at that moment in my life I thought this could be really interesting. So I didn’t take that exam. I took an exam that was about eight months down the line because they only gave it twice in a full year, but I prepared for it. But when I researched it, I decided this at that moment, with my level of maturity or my development as a professional, this could be a really interesting life because in fact, I was sort of living it. For ten years. I’d been living outside the United States, and I decided I would put all my energy into studying for the exam, doing well, and hopefully being offered a position. If that hadn’t worked, I would move on to plan B, but it worked and I was given an immediate offer of employment. It was almost like I was living a dream, and within a week or two weeks I was, you know, I moved to Washington DC and about a month later to Mexico.
what were the life changes when you compare yourself from journalism and then to diplomacy?
One led to the other. When you live on the local economy, you know how to be street smart. You learn to observe how important that is. You ask questions. So all of those skills that I had just as a traveler, explorer, journalist, someone who loved living abroad were transferable, including adaptability, flexibility, doing my own investigation and research before arriving, trying to learn the sensitive historical points that every country has. Learning the geography. All of those were transferable skills. Of course, I learned the technical statecraft of diplomacy. That was very important, but I brought into that career just essential skills that any true diplomat knows are essential to be effective on the ground, which is basically also learning, knowing and asking about the reality on the ground. If for any reason our interpretation could miss the mark, you know, because everyone potentially has a filter or a bias that may not be true to what’s anchoring any series of events that are occurring. So how did your early roles prepare you for your future positions in diplomacy and strategic communications? Writing. Drafting. Proofreading. Interviewing. Analysis. Knowing how to be strategic. If I only have three minutes with a person, what am I going to ask? Knowing how important it is because people are extremely busy. When you think of a diplomat, it’s like concentric circles. There’s the immediate environment, there’s the national environment. There are the regional implications of what’s happening. There’s Washington in my case, you know, there’s headquarters perspective, there’s multilateral alliances. So all of those things are happening. So learning how to put important Information up front for someone who may have very little time to read what I’m sending them. Again, the higher you rise in the career. It is a very competitive career, but the less time people may have in. Ambassador is divided in many ways, and even someone at any level is doing many things at any single point in time. So knowing how to prioritize what I will ask, what I will need, and making sure that that’s not 45 lines down in an email.
can you describe how your experience as a seminar instructor in Tokyo contributed to your professional growth?
I think every experience contributes if one is attentive, if one takes these opportunities seriously. In that case, it turns out I was not only teaching critical thinking, but because of the surrounding culture, where there’s an expression in Japanese that a single nail stands out or the single nail gets hammered in. But it’s the same perspective that the collective reigns supreme and harmony is achieved in that collective. So here in critical thinking, I’m basically asking each individual to give his or her own viewpoint. I’m teaching public speaking because when I’m asking you a question, I actually want your answer, and that’s the answer I’m listening to. I also was very conscious about catching people off guard. It wasn’t because they raised their hand necessarily that I was going to call on them. Maybe I was going to call on the person to the left or to the right or behind. So people really had to be attentive. It was as all learning, I believe, or positive learning, it was two way. I learned a lot because I also learned that technique for some people was very new, and if I had a new person in class, I may really have had to take a step back to explain to that person. Welcome. We all welcome you. You know, this is the way we’ll operate. So I could be assured that mentally, maybe I didn’t catch the person off guard and I could get the best of him or her. And that’s a life lesson. Sometimes taking a step back is taking a step forward. And it’s really okay in my view. It’s just all things add to who we are and how we are. So what were some pivotal moment or decisions in your early career that you believe sets the stage for your later success? My career in publishing was singly focused. I worked in the literature department. Then I moved to really where I wanted to move foreign language publishing at the university level. But at some point that entity had a like a large structural organizational change, and I thought I might not be a good fit for that change.I believe they thought I might not be a good fit for that change. Every every book I edited had my name on it. So for me, you know, my reputation was at stake in everything I did. And so I left the company after a lot of thought about what that would mean, because it took me a lot to get there. I actually began as an intern, and I remember calling my father, who was traveling in Indonesia. I actually had to find where he was. I had no idea where he was. I don’t even know what time zone he was in, but I remember just saying, I’m going to make this really difficult move. What do you think? Because he was always someone that supported me in all of my, you know, very unusual moves. And he said, just do it. And those were three really simple words. But I felt supported in, in making a very radical decision. And I thanked him and apologize for whatever time zone I had interrupted. and that was my decision. And so my next decision was, Now I’m going to do what I’ve always known I really wanted to do with publishing, which was take my skills abroad. And so that began my search to work in Argentina, which I was able to do several months later.
any situation you remember when you have to take a step back and which proved to be beneficial in the future?
I was accepted to Harvard Graduate School. For me, that was a very big achievement. No one in my family, no one in my extended family ever went to Harvard. It was not within my realm of the known, except that it happened to be the very prestigious university where in the town I was living. Because I had been working for 6 or 7 years. The rhythm of academia was something I had lost. So I began the program, graduate program, and the year I began, I was one of only five young people chosen for that program in romance languages and literatures. And after a week or two, I recognized that I was not the usual me. Normally I’m very passionate. I’m very driven. I’m, you know, I’m I’m an overachiever. I like very intense, but I noticed I couldn’t deliver. There was something happening that I needed to analyze, so I took a little bit of a step back. I thought, what? You know, what is it? Maybe I’m not ready to do this one. Maybe I’m not capable to. Maybe I’m just not ready. And I decided to go the route of maybe I’m just not ready. Because if I’m not capable, I shouldn’t have been accepted and I probably shouldn’t have applied. So I went to the dean and I said, you know, I worked really hard to get in this program. It’s really meaningful to me, but I would like to take a year off and come back a year from now and start again fresh. And his answer was, you won’t be successful. And those who have done it have never come back. Well, I’m someone who likes a challenge. So when he said that, it was like, 200%, well, I’m going to be the person who’s going to come back. So I’ll see you in a year. So that was my commitment to myself, to him. Of course, probably there was a little bit of I need to prove you wrong, but I also needed to prove myself right. So the month before I was to begin again, I left my job. And the month before I said, you know, this is this was the time I needed to leave. And I spent that entire month reading a marvelous novel by a marvelous Latin American Nobel laureate and, um, got into the rhythm of what it’s like to, despite other distractions and potential wishes, to do something else, I remain focused. And that really helped me regain the rhythm of what it’s like to be a serious academician. So? So I was successful in that sense, but it was definitely a step back. And it was important to analyze why and to figure out how I could do differently and better. And that’s how it went.
can you share a story from your career that highlights a significant high point and what you learned from it?
In Sudan, which is now in a serious state of conflict, but conflict in peace resolution has unfortunately been a great part of its history. I learned what it’s like to empower the unvoiced or the voiceless and how important that is. And I remember I’ve always done grants management because of the nature of many of my jobs. I mean, I didn’t when I was in a couple of leadership positions, but basically for many years. And I remember the person who gave me the most detailed account, the most transparent account of what he was doing was actually the head of a very small nonprofit, and it was by hand. But I was so impressed. He really gave me all the information I wanted and all the receipts. And you learn how important it is in partnerships to make sure that everyone has input so that finally, when you’re taking something forward, you. Everyone feels they have a stake in what you’re doing. They’ve been heard. I learned that the person who’s silent in a meeting is probably an opinion you need to have that. You know, I never ended a meeting without every person speaking. Because my point is, my point was, if you were convoked for the meeting, if you were present, then you have some part of us as a team. So some people like to speak out. Some people you need to create the space to hear them. I, I really learned so much at every point. It was it was a continual exploration in how to get the best from colleagues, how to get the best from me, how to motivate teams, the importance of working with diverse teams from different cultures and different perspectives, and and how to work in sometimes very difficult environments where there might be repression or taboos or sensitivities that, you know, maybe in the case of my government, we wanted to push and take the defense of and advocate for those who were being challenged in the environment. But how to do that and be successful, and how to not get anyone into trouble, but rather be their ally.
what was a particular challenging moment in your career and how did you overcome it?
We can go back to Sudan, who again right now in the context of things, has huge challenges. But it goes back to the point of observing. You may not understand something, but your observations can empower you. So I was doing a live TV interview. There were three of us. It was in Arabic.
I was the only American with two Sudanese and a Sudanese anchor. I don’t really remember the topic. It was probably about international cultural exchange. In this case, it would have been about us, you know, Sudanese cultural exchange in the United States. And in order to do the interview, which was very important to reach the audience in Arabic. So I didn’t speak Arabic fluently, but, you know, this, this, this was this is strategic communications. Who do I need to contact in, in what language can I, you know, can I reach them? So I had, um, you know, some sort of ear device for the interpreter. Simultaneous interpreter to tell me in English what others were saying in Arabic, and the Arabic speakers one, two, three of them. They had the same for the simultaneous interpretation from English to Arabic, so they could hear what I was saying so we could have a fluid conversation. The audience couldn’t really see those, but that’s that’s how it worked. I think there might have been subtitles in in for the audience, but, you know, that was post-production. So at one point it was, you know, it was like 25 minutes or so into a 30 minute interview. Again, I had no watch, but but I could feel that the time had passed and the anchor looked at me and smiled and asked me a question, and the sound dropped out in my ears at least, so I had no idea what question I was being asked. But this was live TV, so I use my process of analysis and I thought, okay, it’s been about this amount of time live. It’s probably a wrap up question. He’s not going to end it with, you know, a hard question. It’s you know, it’s been buoyant up until now. So I’m going to give a wrap up sort of answer. He’s smiling so clearly. You know, typically, you know, it’s a microexpression. You don’t typically smile when you have like a hard edge question. So that’s the question I’m going to answer. Maybe like, you know what. What are my learning points. Any final thoughts? How would I wrap this up at the end of the program? I apologize to the anger. I said, I’m so sorry. I’m not really sure if I was on topic when I answered you, because the interpreter ceased to fill my ears with information and the sound went out and I didn’t hear anything, and he said the same thing happened to me. So it was funny because we were both, in a sense, playing pantomime, but successfully because he was an experienced journalist and he knew Watching my face, how to probably interpret that I was saying something friendly. And so, you know, he kept assenting with his face and that’s how it ended. So, you know, sometimes you might not understand something, but you could understand body language and you could understand tone and you can understand timing and what’s appropriate at that time.
can you describe a time when you faced unexpected obstacles in your role as US Consul general in Chennai, and how did you navigate through them?
I arrived during Covid 19, the pandemic, and that was a very intense period globally, but also for for the mission and for India. And normally when when a new consul general arrives, one of the things one does, and that I’d been planning for for months, was you have receptions and engagement and meet the key players, and not to mention go to a national day for Indian. You know all the things one does so that you can be connected to the community. That is that that is the environment in which one which I was eager to operate. But none of that was possible. So I had to think in terms of this is the unique world for the moment we are all living and and how to project myself in that world and how to connect. And so one of the changes I made was, okay, if I’m going to spend a lot of time online, the space in which I’m doing that has to be remodeled. And I don’t mean major changes, but just the changes to look welcoming and well-lit and visible and even branding, you know, just simple changes that we could do so that when I’m projecting literally the relationship of a nation, you know, the bilateral importance of our india-u.s. relationship. I can do so in a dignified way. That was one the other. I realized it’s extremely important to look after your people. Of course, people, property, everything, patrons. But the part I forgot was that I needed to look after myself. So I remember rescheduling on the grounds where the official Consul General’s residence is. There are some family oriented areas, so like we have a pool and we have a like an exercise area and a I kept thinking, okay, the pool hours, I want to make them as generous as possible so that maybe anyone who needs to swim before going to work, some people actually had to go to work. There are certain jobs that you cannot do. Virtually some of the consular work cannot be done virtually. Obviously, a driver cannot do his or her work virtually, but there are others. So there was a rotating list of people. But in any case, that was that was one of the things. Okay. The pool and access to the pool, because that’s like someone can be there or with his or her family and just have a few moments of feeling normal. But I forgot about myself. So six months later, I realized, oh, I’m living on these grounds. I have the most direct access to the pool. You know, I literally walk, you know, 30m to the pool. I need to be using the pool because I need to be able to decompress, recharge, have a way to reflect on, you know, much of the stress that happens also all the excesses. So then I realized, okay, my routine is going to change and I’m going to swim even earlier before 7:00, so that when that pool opens, it opens for the rest of the community. But I’ve already done my part, and that’s a really important lesson, you know, when when crises, crises hit, one has to look after others. But one also has to look after oneself and also look after those people who may be struggling, because no two people will have the same way of processing a difficult circumstance. And and if someone is struggling, if you as a leader are not the right person to talk to them, try to find out who that can be so that they can they can channel whatever is occurring within them to process a very difficult circumstance.
what was your learning from Covid 19?
Resilience. I think I’ve always been resilient but a different kind of resilience. Resilience. Speaking for a large team, again, I’ve always been someone who just engages stakeholders. That was really important. There was the local government, the host government, the other consulates within the US mission, the embassy headquarters, the US interagency. Just constant communication at all levels, giving predictable communication to American citizens, to the outside world. All of these things were important. Again, it has to do with those same concentric circles that communicating. You’re communicating in predictable ways. You’re trying to tell people when the next piece of information was, and figuring out different ways of communicating, because not everyone hears or reads or takes in information in the same way. So trying to. What will local staff find accessible? Not everyone has access to email. You know, just looking at something in a very 360 degree way.
what are some memorable experiences that have stood out to you during your tenure as Public Affairs Counselor at the US Embassy in Lima?
So I was there three years. The staff was amazing. So gratifying when you work with staff that just they’re creative. They know their country. They they know how to advise counsel. They know how to contact the right people. They know how to get things done in an innovative way. One memorable moment was a difficult moment. One of our major partners, major, major, major was a binational center because not only did they teach English, which is, you know, a way, an access into American culture, but they were a great partner in so many ways in programming. And we were doing an event to mark their anniversary. So I don’t remember how many tens of years it could have been 70, 75, I’m not sure. But they had been around a long time and that was really important. And we had a partnership. But like in all partnerships, we don’t always come at the same issue with the same perspective.
So there was a moment where the US perspective and the Peruvian perspective were different, different and incompatible. And as a public affairs counselor, I knew that I could not sell their viewpoint to my hierarchy, which was, you know, the executive, unless I myself was convinced. And I knew that I myself was not convinced that this was not viewpoint, a way of presenting something that would be acceptable. So we went around in circles, we did straight lines. We did everything possible to try to find a meeting point, but couldn’t. And so finally I thought, okay, who’s the right messenger? You know, I’ve got the message, we have the message, but who’s the right messenger? And so I delegated, which is very, very important skill of delegation to again, a very creative person on my team. And I said, we’re going to make a phone call, and it’s going to be very clear that this is my phone call, but that you are speaking on my behalf, and you will have your voice to represent our voice, because he was a great person and he could understand both perspectives because he was working at the US embassy. He knew what I was saying. He was a Peruvian. He could understand their perspective. So he had the proper dual sensitivity. And I remember thinking when we were done and did reach an agreement, like, he’s the diplomat, you know, he’s like, he was amazing. It was like an amazing victory. And I was just like watching in awe, trying to not speak, really not trying because that was the deal, you know, not speaking, just speaking in my head as he was navigating a very difficult conversation, but doing so with skill. So you never know who is the right messenger. And you have to identify and you have to identify where the red lines like this is. There’s no compatibility here, but where’s that area where there is an opening, a possible understanding for a meeting point and try to move ahead there. So yeah, that was a great memory. Yeah, he was just my hero.
how do you stay resilient and adaptable when working in high stress, volatile situations around the world?
Everyone’s different. I love writing, it’s one of the ways I process sometimes very difficult circumstances. It’s a companion because sometimes in difficult circumstances, things shut down. Like, yeah, maybe you were going to go out, but guess what? You can’t. So, you know, it’s one of those things that, okay, I control my environment. I’m going to write. It’s here. But knowing how to identify when stress might be present. Knowing your own signs of whom? I didn’t answer that in the right tone. Or wow, this seems to be bothering me more than usual. You know, knowing those signs within yourself that you may be stressed because you may be so stressed that you don’t notice your stress. Even better, have a way to recharge and decompress. For me, I love exercise, but I don’t like exercise. That’s just in a confined area, so I swim. Even now. I swim every day. You know, it’s just it’s movement areas where I could cycle, where I could walk, you know, whatever it is that you can do, if that’s something you like, really important. Also important, know when your mind is headed toward a problem or a challenge and when you actually need rest from that. So yeah, it’s a very difficult circumstance. I’ve been thinking about it. Now I need to not think about it. You know, I need to literally take my mind and move it elsewhere. And if I need to move it into blank mode, that’s what I need to do. If I need to move it into positive thinking, that’s what I need to do. But you know, but literally talk to yourself to decide, wait, this is my brain and I get to take it where I want to go. We get to travel together. So, um, those are some things a creativity. For me, art is an amazing inspiration. You know, that sort of separation from what I’m doing into a new world, a new perspective, a new way of seeing things and or portraying them. So whatever works for the individual. But knowing what those elements are that take you to a fresh perspective, maybe it’s, you know, going out with friends and just, oh my goodness, in this circumstance, no one is thinking of my issue. They’re thinking of other things, or we’re laughing or we’re celebrating our friendship, family, whatever it is here, I have the great advantage of walking along the ocean’s edge, the shoreline. I mean, for me, there’s nothing looking at the horizon. It’s infinite, you know, just everyone’s different. But figuring out how you recharge, your resilience, how you regain a positive perspective, how you refocus and definitely just move away from something that’s challenging into something that gives you satisfaction, a sense of success or calm, and then moving back to whatever, whatever that issue is when you’re ready and I’m sorry, last point will be take notes. Okay. So when I’m in this circumstance, you know, what are the three things that I need to do? Or what are the three things I need to find out trying to be organized about it.
how do you handle the pressure and maintain your composure during critical diplomatic negotiation when you know something might be difficult?
Prepare internally. I have a tendency to talk very fast. The faster I think, the faster I talk, probably the more incoherent I am. So in a circumstance of stress, I might pull back the pace because I know maybe I have a tendency to speak too fast. Plus, when I’m thinking or the pressure is on or it gets difficult, I really want to be careful about my words. Maybe someone says something deliberately Provocative. Take a moment. Assimilate and then move on. You know, don’t. Don’t be reactive. Be proactive in the sense that, okay, I’m going to choose the moment and tone and how I wish to respond. All of those things. Listen carefully. You know who in the room could be an ally? Always, always, always in meetings like this, plan in advance with your team. Or if you’re solo, what are the points that may come up and what are my responses to those? It’s so-and-so, says A where do I go with that? If so-and-so says B, what’s my reaction? And then think of the scenario where we have run out of solutions. What do I do? What’s my bottom line? Where is it a no go negotiation? Is that is that a thing? Am I in that room because I need a solution or I need a way out? Or, you know, in discussing with whoever I’m representing is a non solution, a solution, you know, just knowing where the guardrails Are knowing what the sensitive points are so that you don’t mention them, because maybe at that moment, mentioning them even unintentionally, can can send a discussion into a focus that distracts you from the real focus. So, you know, being very intellectual about it, you know, how will you get the best results out of this? When someone is provocative, whether it’s intentional or not, notice that something is happening within your body and regulate that you know that’s your first key, whether it’s a flush in the face, whether it’s a wish to react, to quickly pull it back, you know, just knowing what’s happening within yourself, being very self-aware.
what advice would you give to individual inspire aspiring to build a career in international relations and diplomacy?
I hope you love that area, because I think we all give our best when we’re passionate about what we do research. What does it involve? What are the different career tracks? What is your value added? Be very globally aware always. If you read local news, start to read. Read or you know, listen or watch. Regional news, international news. You can learn so much before you become a diplomat as to what different governments do, how they engage with different stakeholders. Communication skills are essential writing, drafting, editing, speech writing, reporting, crisis communications. One of the things I love to do is watch interviewers who are really skilled. So maybe there’s a diplomat who’s representing your country and that person you’ve always followed that career will look at how he or she takes on this interview, look at the way he or she answers, how prepared they are, you know. Learn from others. If for any reason there’s a difficult moment, look at how it’s handled. If it if it doesn’t go well, think of okay, well how would you do differently? But then look at the other side, look at who’s interviewing and how they’re trying to get the best out of that person. Or maybe not how they’re trying to get that person to to answer something that that person is not, you know, willing to answer. But I would say, just again, observing history books are so important. Fiction books, I always alternate between fiction and nonfiction because fiction is art, and as all art, it gives you tools that are of the author’s own making. So history revealed and discussed through analysis is is one access point, but also through the creative process is another. You may get, you know, a very individualistic perspective on something. So all of those things. But when I prepare to be a diplomat, I will say I read about the Constitution of my country, comparative economic theory, global politics, the history of diplomacy, geography. I basically lived my entire life, but I still read about geography, political crises. There’s just so many, so many sources of information that you can get smart on and that will help you ultimately. And then should you have that successful career, continue that that routine before you are deployed. Wherever you deploy, do your research, investigate, study culturally what that country has to offer. Who are their major figures? I mean, you can’t possibly go to a country and not know the five most important or spoken about figures. And that includes, you know, emerging voices, youth, whoever like who? The change makers just try to try to be grounded in where you are in their reality, and just as just as they live their country, you should be able to live that country and know what the points of intersection are between your country and that country, because every country looks out for its own interests. And the best and most sustainable policies are that convergence of my interests and yours and that win win solution where it works for you and it works for me. So we both have an interest in seeing that pan out successfully and hopefully peacefully.
how important is continuous learning and professional development in your field and how do you stay updated?
Really important. Now I’m also in a position of continuous learning. My last boss was 21 years old, so you can imagine I’m also learning from a very different way of approaching things. But continuous learning is accessible all the time, whether it’s observing a webinar, a speech, a Ted talk, a course you have to keep current with your skills. And what are the trends? What are the trends going? Are you versed in those trends when people use terminology? Do you understand that terminology? Do you need to read up or speak with someone or say, look, you know, in my field I’m really great at these things, but or, you know, say to your supervisor, but here’s an area where I can identify as a growth area. Can you help me? Or peer to peer learning? Is there someone in my company who can teach me or in exchange? You know, it’s very, very important because life is not static. Life moves sometimes backwards, sometimes forward, sometimes sideways. But life is a continuum. So even if there is a recurrence of something, it will never be the same. The context is always fluid. So I would really encourage continuous learning. It’s gratifying. You’re always enriching yourself, and you’re always providing value added as a skill to someone who’s looking for someone who is capable of adapting because a new circumstance will involve continuous learning.
what are some common misconceptions about working in international relations and diplomacy?
I think a common misconception that I myself had for a long time before being a diplomat was that diplomats are disconnected from reality. So a good diplomat is not a good diplomat, really has his or her feet on the ground, is aware of local reality, the multiple realities different people in society live.
Go out, be street smart. Find out what things cost on the local economy. How difficult it might be is for public or private transportation, what the traffic is like, everything. What the news is reporting. So yeah, common misconception is that we’re in a sort of ivory tower. But if that might be the case, please remove yourself from the ivory tower and be just on the street. So one example, as a new consul general during the time of Covid, where many things were not possible, one of the things I did consistently was I got out and walked and I would choose a different neighbourhood each time, and I just walk the neighbourhood in South India and observed and just learned a lot. And, you know, that might seem unusual, but for me, being out and about, which was one of the things that was very difficult to do, and since I couldn’t be in meetings necessarily or groups, but I could be on the streets because, you know, if there’s a crowd, well, I could just turn left or turn right. So that was my way of compensating and trying to be grounded in a reality that I did need contact with. And that was very hard to gain in a different way in the circumstance.
your career path has several transactions. How do you approach these changes and what drives you your desire for a new challenges?
I thrive on change and challenge, so I guess I’m always looking out for the next change and the next challenge, maybe about every six years. It’s sort of a cycle, but it’s never the same cycle really. Every two or 3 or 1 year it’s changing, but I look for them. What am I ready for next? What do I want to learn next? What’s the environment I wish to be in next? Right now, for me, it’s really important. Global causes, giving back to society, making sure I’m learning, continually learning. I’m not sure what’s next. Of course I’m doing my research. I’m analyzing. I’ve got plan A, B, C, and D, I always do. But knowing what drives you, because if you have a sense of purpose of inspiration, it’s a risk. But you have the strength within you to make it work because you know why you’re doing that. And that’s very important because things will be difficult. Things will always be difficult. But if you have the grounding of why you’ve taken on that step or why you’ve stepped back to move forward, then it can help take you through those hard moments.
how do you balance your professional responsibilities with personal interest and continuous learning?
Well, I wish the day had more than 24 hours in it because I am always looking to stretch that. But I balance between exercise critical for me work, intellectual endeavors, research, reading, writing, nature exploration. I love exploration, traveling, hobbies, photography. You know, I don’t know how I balance. I just try to do it all and take my keys from, let’s say I have a very important presentation to write. But if I find that at that moment, you know, I have an important presentation to write on human rights, which is my focus at the moment. Well, if I find I’m distracted, then I go with that and say, okay, I’m going to give myself 45 minutes of of creativity, whatever creative project, and then I’m going to go back to the other because I need this calm moment where I can intellectually give the best of myself. But I clearly also need a break because I’ve been going at it all day. So, you know, just looking at the signs within yourself of what’s the best moment for me, early morning is like huge amount of energy. Not that that diminishes too much throughout the day, but it is like a large, you know, energy boost. And so sometimes I, you know, do a lot of things that might be very difficult at that time because I know I’m going to have that extra natural two hours that I’m just I do in a shorter period of time. What maybe at the very end of the day or at night might take me longer because I’ve put in a full day. So just knowing your biorhythm is part of it.
what are some effective time management strategies you use to handle your diverse responsibilities?
Time management is essential. There are many different ways to approach time management. One is good communication skills. Make sure that you and the team and whatever other people on the periphery need to know. Know what they need to know to do their part of the job. You can create a document where you track the progress on different tasks. Sometimes there’s a way to do it by color or percentage or both, and you can see how you’re progressing. Always know what you can front load. If I can do all these things now, well, those are five things I don’t need to do last minute because I can get them done. Now. There are some things you can only do last minute, so make sure you have a chronology of those things. And when you need to do them where you might have flexibility, where you don’t. You know, if I need to reserve a venue, well, I need to do that upfront because if I don’t have the venue, I don’t have a place to do it. You know, design an invitation. You can get that done really early. You can tweak it last minute, but use your team delegate. Who can you empower to take on? Maybe for the first time, a job, a responsibility he or she has never had? Mentor that person through it Or if it’s not you. Find a mentor because because you’re giving that person an opportunity doesn’t mean they don’t have questions. So make sure they have the support to do it right. Have check ins with the team again in your time management. Decide okay, so this is a six week project in three days. I want to know your your outline in a week. I want to know where you are in progress in two weeks. You know, one week before three days before. Decide what your timeline is. Do not let five weeks and five days go by before you as the leader, get your feedback on how things are going. It’s very hard to self-correct course at that time. So yeah, factor in all those things you can do. Of course, calendar invites just reminders on calendar reminders, shared calendars, shared documents are wonderful. I’m very big. On if it’s a shared document, give me in the document. When the last day and the last hour of update took place on that document, because otherwise I don’t know, like, is this accurate as of three days ago or is this accurate as of three minutes ago? So yeah, all those things, all those things and anything you can do that has like a shared aspect is a good communication, obviously a WhatsApp group, but you might have several WhatsApp groups, you know, the team that’s only doing whatever, something technical, the communications team, the larger group. But you don’t want to waste people’s time for tasks that only a small group of people need to know. But you do want to use people’s time to give them an update. Okay, now team B, you can now use your time to move to that state. So it’s multidirectional communication skills. It’s tracking. It’s knowing where the strengths are and who needs to develop those strengths. So maybe someone has a strength. That person can be the mentor for someone else who’s really eager, wants the strength. But it can be, you know, monitored and mentored by someone else.
how do you stay motivated and inspired in your work even when facing setbacks?
In general, motivation and inspiration are not among my challenges. I guess I am inspired by people, I am inspired by places, and I’m really inspired by people who are able to channel adversity into opportunity and leadership. So I think that best describes my current circumstance. And always asking yourself, what can I get out of this experience? So if it went well, making sure everyone knows, you know, thank you. Thank you for your thank you for your participation. Thank you for doing this for the first time. Thank you for investment in time. You know, making sure you get that positive vibe from showing appreciation, receiving theirs. If something didn’t go well, like, okay, we’re going to do this better, let’s let’s do our, you know, analysis. What can we do differently. And then giving yourself a break. This didn’t go well. But next time we are going to do it well because now we know one of the things that we we didn’t think of and now we’re we’re forewarned. So yeah, I think I’m inspired by those around me, some of whom live very, very difficult realities and take from those realities a source of strength within them that definitely inspires me and motivates me. So can you share a time when you experience a significant career setback, and how did you bounce back from it? One doesn’t always get the job one wants, so in US diplomacy, we lobby for a job. We do our best. It’s almost like every 2 or 3 years you’re looking for a new job because you basically are looking for a new position, usually in a new country or a new department or a new bureau. But we don’t always get our first choice. So knowing if that doesn’t work out, why the other choices are still good. So there was a position I really, really wanted in Washington. It was really difficult to get, but I didn’t get it. And so I then just had already planned faith, maybe in the other list, but I had that other list of okay, so if I didn’t get this because it was on a different timeline, what do I do next? And I guess that’s just, you know, what you have to do. It’s like we don’t always get our way. We don’t always get our wish. So what do you do? What’s next? What is interesting and attractive. But maybe for a slightly different reason. And again, that you can learn from. So every setback it happens bounce back. We’re you know, humans are highly imperfect beings But that’s the nature of who we are as a human race. We continue to prove that on a global scale. So let’s learn from that. So how do you handle criticism and negative feedback in your professional life? Receiving criticism and giving criticism. Not easy when you receive criticism. Try to consider in what way was it given to you? Was it to help you grow, to do better from someone who cares about you or the team? Was it given in anger? In which case maybe it wasn’t reflective? Maybe it was reflective. Sometimes in anger, someone says something that they couldn’t say under normal circumstance. So you know that analysis is important. Again, the whole breathe. Don’t answer. In fact, if you’re not ready to answer, then you can say thank you. I’ve heard you, I’ve taken notes or I’ve assimilated what you said. Let me get back to you. Let me think about what you said. You know, you’re not always under pressure to respond. And sometimes responding at that moment is is not the best thing. So yeah. How is it given? Why was it given? If multiple people give you the same Criticism. It’s worth looking at because different people who have different perspectives are picking up on something within you. I find sometimes an apology, whether it’s written, whether it’s in person, what the right time to send it is or what the right time to give it. Sometimes for me, that just like, takes all the pressure away from me. Oh you’re right. Goodness. At that time, I didn’t mean to say that, or I certainly didn’t mean the way you’re taking it or, you know, whatever it is. So an apology can help. Not just deflect, but reduce the tension that one caused, perhaps unintentionally. When you give criticism, you know what’s the right moment? What else is that person experiencing at that time? What time of day is it? Is it someone who wants it written? Is it someone who wants oral feedback? Consider where it is that you want to discuss something with someone. Sometimes I found that going to someone else’s office can allow that person to be in their comfort zone. Sometimes in my office, because no one can see that they’re coming to an office to discuss. So consider where it is. Sometimes it’s outside. Every bit of context helps to get the best results and preparing in advance. So obviously when I’m giving criticism, if I if I didn’t know that was coming, it’s hard to prepare in advance. Which is why sometimes taking a pause and saying, you know, thank you, let me get back to you is important. But when I’m delivering the criticism, I need to know where I’m going with that conversation and you know what the result is. And if the ultimate result is that person feels valued, that’s one thing. That person knows that I made a mistake. That’s another. That person knows that will do differently moving forward. You know, whatever it is, but know what your end game is and allow for what you don’t know, which is that person’s world and how they’ve processed something. So always consider is it best that that person begin or you can give them the option. Thanks for meeting with me. I’m sorry. I’m taking, you know, time away from whatever. I know you’re really busy on a project. Let let’s begin with you, you know, but whatever. Try to consider in advance how you want to begin that.
can you discuss a failure or mistake you made in your career and the lesson you learned from it?
I’ve made many mistakes. What I’ve learned, I mean, I’ve learned in general. Just like we make mistakes and to not be hard on ourselves when we do that. So I think more than a single example, it’s it’s just in general what to do when we make a mistake. It goes back to we are human, we are subject to failing sometimes and just draw from that a different way of doing something. I remember a huge audience and bringing to that audience an experience that was completely unique to peoples that did not bilateral relationship. That was very challenged. And I thought the program was amazing, but my boss didn’t. So I was very surprised to find out from like elation to deflation that I thought I did some I thought we the team had did something amazing and the perspective was different. So I had to meet with that person and listen to that person’s perspective who was a very high up position, and understand that perspective and then deliver that to the team. So I remember, like, you know, calling the meeting, of course, I had, you know, very good relationship with my team, but okay, let’s sit in a circle, you know, so we all sort of commune at this moment. And I had to deliver what my boss literally called a post-mortem, which is like a terrible metaphor that I also learned I will never use when I’m in a leadership position. I mean, not that that would have occurred to me, but it was almost like something deathly had happened. So, you know, just I’ll never forget that. And another boss criticized me in an email that was had like massive, massive CC line. And it’s just like, don’t do that. And I remember writing back to say, you know, mentorship is really best not done while publicly shaming someone. I can’t, I can’t believe I had a job after that. But I remember saying that because that was what I felt as a person that I, I made like a very innocent mistake as a new officer. Someone recommended I do something that person was more seasoned than I was, and I just took it face value, what the person said. So, you know, do x and I did x. Well, it turns out X was reaching out to a high level. I didn’t know that. Believe me, from then on, I knew that. Thank you. You’ve told me to do something. Now I’m going to research that person before I do it, because maybe your advice is not great advice. So we just we learn, we learn and we do better. So how important is networking in building a successful career in international relations? Networking is so useful. You can have networking at all levels. You can have peer networking. You can have mentorship, networking, regional networking. Decide which network is for which purpose. I know that I found out, sort of found out because I knew where I was working. I knew about where I’m currently working, but I, you know, was rekindled in my head through my network, through my network, I learned about ways to approach certain entities that hadn’t occurred to me through my network. I there probably at least three jobs that I specifically applied for within the context of diplomacy. That never would have occurred to me if different people hadn’t said, you should look into this. You should apply to this. This could be a good job for you. And what they were not saying was, I have a connection that will get you the job. But they were saying was, I have confidence in you, in your growth, in your ability to take on new leadership that you yourself are not seeing. So think about it. In all cases, the first thing I did was explore what is this position? What does it involve? What is the country like? Places I had never considered, maybe for various reasons, and maybe for no good reasons or positions I had not considered. So the network is important because sometimes we don’t see qualities in ourselves that others are seeing, and when they respect us, what they’re also seeing is potential for growth.Certainly as a woman, one of the tendencies for women is what’s called the the imposter syndrome, when we certainly this job can’t be for me, certainly I can’t take this level on. But yeah, you can. Other people are just like, they need a position filled. They see a good candidate. Maybe they see multiple good candidates. You are one of them. So. Yeah. Networks. Networks are very, very important. They open doors, they open opportunities. They they share information about talks that can be inspirational or orientating. Yeah. I would encourage you to find out those networks. There are so many virtual networks. There are in-person networks. There are association related networks of all sorts. And whether it’s for pastimes or professional purposes, they all have a purpose, utility and sometimes an outlet, an outlet for wow. You know, this was a really difficult political moment when this happened. What is this group saying about it? Is this just me or what do others who think like me, what is their viewpoint?
what message would you like to share with young individuals who inspire to make a significant difference globally?
Thank you in advance for doing so. Youth. Young people, globally interested individuals. You are basically the future of this planet. You are living the present, but you are constructing the future. You were born into technological tools that can both be our allies and can be challenges. So it’s up to you to continue finding solutions. I have great faith in individuals who will take us forward. I always think about, you know, giving back and the next generation is the current generation. Leaders who never leave power can be problematic. So you know, you are whatever that voice will be. And that’s always changing. As I said, life is not linear. Taking a step back to take a step forward is a good thing. Doing your research to open your mind. Some people want to give back globally and yet don’t want to be globally deployed. There are so many ways of working or volunteering On the international level, you can have a virtual global. Internship. So global deployment is not for everyone. If you love change. Global deployment is marvelous because you’re always learning. But I thank you in advance for the work that I know you will do. It’s our future. It becomes your future. So thank you for your leadership moving forward.
how important is to develop cross-cultural communication skills and what are some effective ways to do so?
We live in an interconnected global environment in an instant. In any point on Earth, I might be able to find out what is happening on the other side. So global skills such as foreign languages should be highlighted in your resume. What’s the level of proficiency you have speaking, reading or writing? Because there are different skills. Uh, List all of those languages. And what are the proficiency Sea levels. Oftentimes applications will say, you know, whatever, you know, Arabic preferred or Arabic required, or, you know, whatever the skill is. So like foreign languages, foreign languages are usually a skill accompanied by cultural sensitivity, because to speak a language, you have to, in a sense think like locals do, because some of the expressions are very culturally specific. So the ability to work with, to successfully work in and with diverse teams, uh, many companies have branches abroad or have advisors for those moving abroad. There’s just so much you can do, uh, in an international setting. So languages cross cultural adaptability. Adaptability, period. When you’re moving to a new country, you have to be able to immediately be effective. What does that mean? It means you’re alert. You’re aware. You’re observing, you’re flexible. Things may not work the way they worked wherever you were before. You know a sense of time. Some places are very elastic. Some places are very literal. I come from a country where the sense of time, time management is very literal. You know, in email someone may write it and not even greet you to say, how are you? Because they’re getting right to the point. But in some cultures, you will not succeed if you don’t first go through pleasantries, you know, good morning, how are you? And then you go into whatever you need. So knowing where you are and knowing that where you are changes everywhere. Communication skills include, again, the ability to speak public speaking in different environments globally. Some people are extemporaneous, some peoples, some cultural contexts. They don’t. People give very coherent speeches, but no one’s looking at notes and that is more respected. The ability to connect eye to eye and know where you want to go, or maybe improvise rather than textually. This is what I need to say, or could be a combination. I will improvise, but I definitely need to get to a certain point. So yeah, cultural relativity is out there, and the more accustomed you are to navigating cultural relativity, the more successful you will be each time.
in your view, what role do young people have in addressing global challenges such as climate change, social justice and international diplomacy?
Yeah, all, you know, climate change, social justice and diplomacy, all things that are extremely important. I hope you, the youth of today and the future you will build can create a more peaceful, interrelated Related global system. I hope through youth we can find a collective ways of addressing global challenges. What happens in one ocean eventually comes to the other. What happens on one side of the planet has repercussions elsewhere. I think you’re keenly aware of those things, because many of the crises that we experience are manifestations of some of those imbalances. So being sensitive to the chain of events that none of us live in a real bubble. Certainly there are places on Earth that are remote that are difficult to get to, but they ultimately, if a natural disaster occurs, for instance, can be equally vulnerable. So you have a very important role in looking after climate change, in creating a more inclusive, equitable, just world. And diplomacy is not I win, you lose. Diplomacy is I win, you win. We all win. So finding those ways through regional alliances and ideally global alliances and global input to get the best we can do, every nation will always look out for its interest. But as we’ve seen, when there’s imbalance, when there are crises, orders in a way cease to exist because those forcibly displaced cross borders, they do whatever they need to do to survive. So yeah, just being sensitive to the fact that, um, it’s interrelated.
So now we start a rapid round, rapid round.Ready your favorite book?
Right now I’m reading a book on Africa, on terrorist groups and their regional reach, and how non-state actors fill in where weak states fail to provide for their people.
Dream destination.
Oh, dream destination. I’d love to go to the Horn of Africa. Uzbekistan. Vietnam.
Never ending definition of success.
Define success yourself and let no one else define success for you.
Source of inspiration
People. Places. Adversity turned into opportunity.
Biggest challenge.
Peace on Earth
Favorite movie?
The Interpreter by Sydney Pollack.
Hobbies
Photography. Travel news in foreign languages. Art
Personal hero.
Those who inspire me to do better.
Favorite food?
That depends on where I’m living. It’s geo specific. So right now in the Caribbean. Avocados. Papaya. Plantains.
Favorite culture?
Too many cannot choose favorites because every place I am has something to give me.
Your best memory till date.
Doing things for social justice.
So at last, one line that defines you.
Life is not linear.
So with this we come to an end of our today’s show. So Judith, thank you so much for sharing an incredible journey and profound insights with us today. Your experiences and dedication to fostering global understanding and resilience are truly inspiring. As we wrap up, we are reminded of the immense impact one individual can have on a global scale through perseverance, adaptability, and commitment to positive change. Your work with the Dream project and your extensive career in diplomacy and international relations serve as a beacon of hope and motivation for many. We wish you continued success in all your endeavors, and look forward to seeing the lasting impact of your contributions. Thank you once again for joining us and believe in the future, and for all the valuable advice and wisdom you have imparted to me. Thank you very much for your precious time.
Thanks, Gaurav.
Thank you God, and thanks for providing platforms to inspire youth to continue doing what they do, which is giving us their unique perspective. Thank you so much. Thanks, Carter.
My pleasure.
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